Registered: Jan 2004 Posts: 37 - Threads: 1 Location: Stonehenge
Quote:
World Citizen wrote on 15-04-2004 05:52 PM
Daf wrote
Yes on the SOP's.
Blindness is one hell of a liability in our world and that is exactly why we are collectively flirting with disaster; we as people are largely indoctrinated and blind and cynical and or apathetic.
But you are exactly right not to simply believe me or anyone else for that matter (believe Chomsky though!). I want people to look and think for themselves because I am eminently confident that when people do this they will see the truth staring them right back in the face and the solutions to our grave problems will become ever clear.
TJP
Hmmm not do sure about Chomsky, Pilger Monbiot et al or any of the other feted left wing intellectuals. One rather suspects that to achieve their iconic status they have to conform somewhere along the line. Cia assets even. There is every reason to believe that the media is totally corrupt at an institutional level ie: A journalist may believe that he is totally free to report as he sees. However it is the fact that his belief system co-incides with the prevailing system that allows this. Those that hold views that waver to far from the established line are not going to be employed let alone heard. Try some research on operation nightingale...
Registered: Aug 2003 Posts: 511 - Threads: 46 Location: London
Chomsky is such deep cover CIA that he does not even know he is; and that is why his word is so pure. Not so sure about Chomsky; well then who are you sure of?
Registered: Oct 2001 Posts: 2679 - Threads: 121 Location: London
uh, you read lots of different sources then make your own conclusions.
Chomsky is hardly infallible; he spent years denying the genocidal reality of the Khmer Rouge regime and has frequently glossed over the less savory aspects of Latin American governments/movements that align with him ideologically.
Registered: Aug 2003 Posts: 511 - Threads: 46 Location: London
It goes without saying that you must have more than one source for information. But it is better to have a few good sources then to have a hundred shitty ones; such as most university textbooks on history for example
You are way off base about Chomsky "denying" the genocide in Cambodia; he well acknowledged the genocide there but he also pointed out that a similar genocide was happening at the same time in East Timor; only difference was that we in the west were responsible for that genocide whereas the Cambodian version was not a puppet government for us. And that is why the west is largely ignorant of what happened in East Timor.
As for Central America his accounts of the insanity of US policy there is one of the greatest contributions to ending the state sponsored terrorism we funded.
It never ceases to amaze me how people can deny all or much of the selfless, altruistic work somebody has done because they disagree with this that or the other.
Chomsky is one of the most beautiful people to grace this planet and his life's work is a testament to the commitment he has to TJP.
Registered: Oct 2001 Posts: 2679 - Threads: 121 Location: London
I'm well aware of East Timor. I didn't say Chomsky denies currently Cambodia, merely that he spent many years in the 70's denying what was going on. You might want to look into it.
And indeed he did a good job of exposing the acts of fascist juntas and their CIA collaborators, but he presents a fairy tale version of people like the Sandinistas that is quite a bit off base.
It never ceases to amaze me when people blindly follow intellectuals who happen to agree with their views. Chomsky has done a lot of work, much of it good (indeed excellent), some of it that doesn't hold up so well.
Registered: Aug 2003 Posts: 511 - Threads: 46 Location: London
Bullshit; there was no denial from Chomsky about genocide after facts made clear what was going on there; but please send or post an example of these denials with the date written. Otherwise I say that you have blindly followed a critic whose real agenda was lost on you.
The Sandinista's did in fact cause incredible redistribution of wealth into the poorest classes; clearly they were not perfect (far from it), but they were a marked improvemtn from the "democratic" puppet terrorists the US ultimately forced on Nicaraguans.
That's it now; I am leaving for palestine in two days and I have no more time to debate Chomsky or other issues; but I look forward to your Chomsky genocide denial.
Registered: Nov 2003 Posts: 5029 - Threads: 158 Location: In a big toilet
[Edited by Hoochie Koochi Man on 15-04-2004 21:10 PM]
Quote:
World Citizen wrote on 15-04-2004 08:51 PM
That's it now; I am leaving for palestine in two days
Do you ever get tired of protesting Mr World Citizen? Wouldn't you rather chill out on package holiday in Majorca, sitting by a pool, getting a tan and drinking cocktails?
PS_you can read the papers by the pool to keep uptodate on what is happening in Palastine
Registered: Oct 2001 Posts: 2679 - Threads: 121 Location: London
Have you read Chomsky's After the Cataclysm? It's a long apologia for Communist terror in south-east Asia. It was written in 1979, well after the facts had presented themselves. If you are really that bothered I can find a copy at a library (I borrowed it a while back) and send you notes.
Again, I am not suggesting that Chomsky is always wrong, or even that he is mostly wrong. Just that the left's hero worship of him is a poor show for a tradition that is supposed to be about investigation and not blindly following.
If you can't even admit the possibility that Chomsky might have been wrong at some point, how do you propose that your fantasy mission to untie the knot of Middle Eastern affairs is going to work?